Good break.Really enjoying your blog btw. I was once sympathic to mra concerns as someone who fought for custody of my children to find the courts weighed towards the mother.That sympathy has been battered down through the years to the point of revulsion. However I do have an mra brother so I still look in to see what is feeding his continued anti-social behavior.
What an adorable kitten! I miss having a kitten around.
I name that kitten "Yohan"... that's a cute name for him. Looks like he wants to bite.
Mawww mook at the kitteeee ^_^
This might be a good thread to talk about my mra experience; I haven't posted on a mra blog in years. I posted a number of times and realized that nothing good would come from it. My initial reaction to the mra movement was a positive one; I could see that there were areas where there was bias against men (family courts; homelessness) and how change could be a good thing.However my initial feelings were short lived, I found that posters on these blogs were overwhelmingly not concerned with real issues, but were instead ingrained within their own personal histories.Meaning: next to know one was doing anything to make their fellow men’s life better. There would be a complaint in context regarding feminism about homeless men, men in prison, men in abusive relationships but no one even pretending to do something in real life. All I saw was a regurgitation of the same complaints over and over again about their own lives with no solution.At this point most people would just close the window so to speak, however I have a brother who latched on to the mra online experience, who has without a doubt mental/personality disorders, so I’ve read mra blogs and forums on and off, most often to check up with what’s feeding my brothers newest delusion. This is the first source I have read that in a concise way challenges what I’ve been fighting for; for years, my oldest brother being really challenged by quotes you can’t walk away from. Thank you for that! I’m not sure if this blog will help or just feed his paranoia, but it’s worth a chance. Please don’t give up!
"Meaning: next to know one was doing anything to make their fellow men’s life better. There would be a complaint in context regarding feminism about homeless men, men in prison, men in abusive relationships but no one even pretending to do something in real life. All I saw was a regurgitation of the same complaints over and over again about their own lives with no solution."---The above isn't what MGTOW is all about, but feel free to blast the whole thing based solely on your brother and your experience and keep engaging in logical fallacies while you're at it. Bravo.
WytchYour ability in lightening up the mood is better then the kitten!(check your acronyms) As far as MGTOW.. JUST DO IT!!!!!!!! My best friend is a life long bacholer, he doesn't need to sit in a forum all day in order to be one. He's a funtioning human who happens to not be cut out for marriage. No big deal.
"As far as MGTOW.. JUST DO IT!!!!!!!!"---DI am indeed! Hell, yeah!
You're not wytch, instead you spend half your day talking about women. I assume that means that you are thinking about women. It's really sad, and I hope one day you can stop.
"You're not wytch, instead you spend half your day talking about women. I assume that means that you are thinking about women. It's really sad, and I hope one day you can stop."--DActually, you need to stop projecting your personal malaise on myself. I spend most of my day doing something else---if that doesn't convince you, I'll let you to your own devices and have you look in the mirror. Your hypocrisy is really sad. I'll do myself a favor and ignore you completely on this site. Adios!
And D, don't you ever tell me what to do. It's presumptuous and crass.Flowers and Kittens,wytch
This is just what a female would do David. That's the correct definition of a Mangina, by the way.All the kittens in the world won't help. Stop the Agitprop.
Mad kitten is madhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/lov-ela/3307669828/
I cannot help but notice this blog is full of commentary such as you would typically get from high school students. What age range does your readership fit into Dave?
@SalosWhat is the average age of a radical feminist who is into 'shaming language' because of missing arguments?Good question...For quality of comments from a feminist, see example below.booboonation said... I name that kitten "Yohan"... that's a cute name for him. Looks like he wants to bite.
kisses to Yohan... thanks for noticing you fuzzy little rascal.
Here's some more depressing newsEnshrined in Law Since 1930: Only Men Can Be Slaveshttp://www.ilo.org/ilolex/cgi-lex/convde.pl?C029"C29 Forced Labour Convention, 1930Convention concerning Forced or Compulsory Labour (Note: Date of coming into force: 01:05:1932.)Date of adoption:28:06:1930Article 11. Each Member of the International Labour Organisation which ratifies this Convention undertakes to suppress the use of forced or compulsory labour in all its forms within the shortest possible period.2. With a view to this complete suppression, recourse to forced or compulsory labour may be had, during the transitional period, for public purposes only and as an exceptional measure, subject to the conditions and guarantees hereinafter provided.Article 111. Only adult able-bodied males who are of an apparent age of not less than 18 and not more than 45 years may be called upon for forced or compulsory labour."
nicko81m:News? From 1930?First of all, this is not a law. This is a convention adopted by the International Labor Organization in Geneva. It is not binding on member states.Secondly, section 3 of article one specifically states that "At the expiration of a period of five years after the coming into force of this Convention, and when the Governing Body of the International Labour Office prepares the report provided for in Article 31 below, the said Governing Body shall consider the possibility of the suppression of forced or compulsory labour in all its forms without a further transitional period and the desirability of placing this question on the agenda of the Conference."According to the European Commission, C29 "paved the way for the 1956 Supplementary Convention on the Abolition of Slavery, the Slave Trade, and Institutions and Practices Similar to Slavery."Which you can read here:http://www2.ohchr.org/english/law/slavetrade.htmUse. Google. For five seconds.
1. Only adult able-bodied males who are of an apparent age of not less than 18 and not more than 45 years may be called upon for forced or compulsory labour." This shows clearly that women had it better in the past. Men were always considered to be 2nd class citizens - what a great privilege...
Oh no! Those evil 1930s women who ran the ILO and forced men into labor camps as slaves! Woops! My mistake. It was Albert Thomas who was in charge of ILO back then. And while Harold has been the name of a woman before (Anne Rice's real name) she is American, and not British like the second leader Harold Butler.Good grief, if you are going to complain about something subordinating men, try not to use an organization run by men as your example.
Well Wytch, you do spend a heck of a lot of time posting here, an anti-misogyny website. This is your way of not being concerned about women?
There is an illusion being perpetuated by MRAs that there is oppression Olympics going on, or it's all a contest. The oppression of women FOR BEING WOMEN exists, and it did especially at the time of this forced labor act that nick has turned up. I think people should be wary feeding into this crap. The oppression of men does NOT remove or minimize women's issues in society, but nice try. You can CLAIM feminism does this, and you do...but your claim fails. It is MEN that have tried to make this a contest. Please people, don't feed into this. http://edition.cnn.com/2010/BUSINESS/03/12/ceo.health.warning/index.htmlIn no way does the stress the CEO is under remove the pressures of those under him. And Nick, you really must stop with all these shaming tactics. You know who forced men into slavery? OTHER MEN. Isn't that correct? Stop with the contests already, and respect the boundaries. Anti-feminism MRA is about a bunch of misogynists invading our boundaries trying to tell us we cannot have a movement or our own issues. YOU do not get to define what our issues are. Men have culturally defined women since the beginning of human time, now deal with the fact that we have issues from being otherized like that. Stop trampling on our boundaries. And those slaves were enslaved under much broader definitions than just "you have a penis" Just because male priv exists does not mean that there are not some "privileges" for women. MOST women that are prostitutes now a days were trapped and are there against their will. Try THAT kind of forced work. You think it was any different back then? Oh, I know sometimes MEN force boys, too. Yes, MEN. Stop with the oppression Olympics.
"This is your way of not being concerned about women?" ---SallyStrangeAre you concerned about men? You are pretty Strange considering I don't rant about women much here.
Yes, other men forced men into slavery. But this crap about men having it all fine and dandy and sugar and spice in the past is a load of crap. In fact, men had it way harder than women as all the heavy burdens were placed on men. Not only that, from the hard yards men did to get money, men were the financial slaves to women. Men practically paid for everything to keep women living while the only duties women mostly had was to clean the house and babysit the kids. Wow poor oppressed victims.I wonder who were the real slaves in the past? I wonder who were the most oppressed in the past? Regardless if it was the big boys in the governments oppressing the men below, the basic fact is that it's still oppression against men. And this oppression is far more extreme than what any woman faced in the same society. In other words, the big boys on top oppressed men more than they oppressed women. Let’s face it; the only oppressors are simply the men who are on top who were the ones who shaped society. The average man or 99 percent of men were not the oppressors. It was not their fault that men on top shaped society to how it was.But yet, even at this day, men in general in past such as all our great grandfathers get shame, blame, and guilt placed on them in the premise that it was the fault of all men who existed.Even when a male such as myself who was born in 1981 starts to complain about male grievances in the present, I will likely get shame, blame, and guilt placed on me for what a small subset of men in government did in the past. Just to disqualify and invalidate my complaint in the present.UnfuckingbelievableThat’s discrimination and oppression within it’s self. But this form of sexism is the most socially accepted form of sexism that we deal with in western society today.
"MOST women that are prostitutes now a days were trapped and are there against their will. Try THAT kind of forced work"That is a load of feminist baloney. Where do you get the figure of "MOST" from? Sure, some women in Asian countries are forced into prostitution. But the majority are in the go go bars by their own choice. What about all the other hookers around the world? What about all the ones in western societies?
Nick, who told those men they had to work? Other men. Who refused to let women work? Men. So your "men are oppressed" pity party is illogical to have.
"So your "men are oppressed" pity party is illogical to have." Oh poor Elizabeth, she misses the whole point of my post.Let's put it this way. The ONLY people who were NOT oppressed were the big boys in government. Pity party? heh, it’s very ironic how the biggest pity party on this whole planet has been the feminist movement. You femiclowns would have to be the biggest complainers on this whole planet. No other group/movement has nearly done as much complaining, pissing and moaning than the feminist movement throughout history. No other cause even comes close.
I have one for the oppression olympics... I've noticed recently that when men are enslaved, one can easily use the word slavery and nobody will blink an eye. If it's women, you can't use the word slavery easily even under the most dire of circumstances. People say you're being emotional and using rhetoric. That's how you know women's bodies and lives are involved. And Nick your perception of pissing and moaning speaks to YOUR sex life not ours. No, that came out wrong, so to speak, I mean that's your subjective take on what's happening and speaks to your disdain of women. You just admitted it right there. You are a denialist.
booboonation said... MOST women that are prostitutes now a days were trapped and are there against their will.About which country are you talking?
booboonation said... I've noticed recently that when men are enslaved, one can easily use the word slavery and nobody will blink an eye.Absolutely ridiculous statement...
"And Nick your perception of pissing and moaning speaks to YOUR sex life not ours."Please explain how this has to do with my sex life?
I think a good moderation policy would be that if people are going to qoute others they should qoute the entire paragraph. Not snipits of sentences.
LOL nick... you're kidding right? It's just straight up comedy around here. And you offered no reason why my slavery statement was ridiculous. Ask people who work with human trafficking. Even Indentured Servants were referred to as slaves, it was a certain type of slavery. But there is actually slavery that goes on now and people are very reluctant to use that word. Maybe that effects men too, but since the areas I'm looking into effect women and children on the whole I don't know. But maybe I should not take you seriously anyway. You quoted my pissing and moaning/sex life sentence. LOL. That cheered me up though. Today is kind of serious, so...
BooboonationAn easy example of male slavery.What they call "looky looky men" in Europe. North African men promised the promise land to them become 30 deep sleeping in a eight by eight room selling rip-off cd's, purses etc on street corners running away from the police. MRA's don't even have these subjegated men on their radar, and their female sex trade equals who were promised the good life as well don't exist either.To be far the looky looky men don't get enough press... but if I was a western MRA I would be ashamed to compare their version of "slavery" with actual, real slavery.
D, thanks for sharing your experience. Yours is a really valuable perspective to have on this blog. Keep commenting!
I get the feeling booboonation is some bored 25 year old hipster dude having fun at this board's expense. At least I hope so.Random Brother
richard said... I get the feeling booboonation is some bored 25 year old hipster dude having fun at this board's expense. At least I hope so.I think, she really believes what she says,a truly unhappy woman. Lonely and ivory-tower.No hobbies, just thinking from morning to night about how to hate men even more...
Uh, let's just cool it with the personal attacks, ok?
LOL if you guys have points to make, then make them. SO far you have not made any. D. Yes, there is a whole lot of tragedy in the world.There is lots of modern day slavery. My point actually was that when it comes to women's bodies people balk at the word slavery, but with men, they immidiately concede the terminology. That's what I've seen from my person experience reading up on trafficking matters. It doesn't seem like MRAs match feminists even closely in their activism. I learn about these things because of feminists. (yohan, lol, omg.)
@ booboonationProve that people balk at the use of the word slavery for women. Prove it now. Random Brother
richard, it's actually a HUGE issue in trafficking. There's debate over the word, trafficking covers a lot of issues, so an argument against me could be that no, people balk against the term for women AND men, but, I believe it's because women's bodies are involved, I have a hunch. http://www.unmultimedia.org/tv/webcast/2010/11/launch-of-the-united-nations-voluntary-trust-fund-for-victims-of-trafficking-in-persons-especially-women-and-children.htmlwatch the guy drill Demi on it, he's from the NYT. But please note this is to show you it's a known issue, where I get this is from different comments on the web about it that I doubt I could go scrape together. This is months of research. By this video, though you will know what I mean, even if you disagree. Also, I know it's long, but the slavery comments happen fairly quickly.
BTW, the only time I've seen people balk at the term slavery is within the context of sex slavery, so that's why I made that statement. I was not as clear as I should have been on that. Sex industry is my area of research.
@ booboonationWhy am I looking at Ashton Kutcher? I'm sorry, I'm not watching 2 hours of pro fem propaganda.Random Brother
Worst. Kitten break. Ever.
Nick-if you do not want us to based our opposition on the wrong things, be clearer regarding your complaints about something.You are not a fan of women and post something about men being enslaved. It is easy to see why someone reading your comments would see that post as blaming women for something they had nothing to do with. If a male oppresses another male-how is that the fault of women?It is not. So your pity party was illogical based on the information you gave us.
booboonation said... Yes, there is a whole lot of tragedy in the world...It doesn't seem like MRAs match feminists even closely in their activism. ... (yohan, lol, omg.) You talk very much, but your feminist gossip does not help poor people at all.The question is how much money do you give to poor people out of your private wallet?I really wonder while reading your drivel, if you might be willing to take over my monthly regular donation I pay since years for poor people.Interesting that my money I give away so far was used for the benefit of poor women. They don't need money from misogynists like me I guess, so hopefully you will replace me?I support poor people in Philippines (children, or blind, or sick etc.), but only directly of course and I give nothing for feminist charities where it is frequently misused for self administration and never arrives where it should arrive.I have also shipping boxes ready, if you want to send any materials. Are you interested to pay the shipping charges, a part of them at least? Thank you. Looking forward to your reply.
"LOL nick... you're kidding right? It's just straight up comedy around here. And you offered no reason why my slavery statement was ridiculous."It's friggen ridiculous because not MOST prostitutes are forced to have such a pathetic life. As I said, of course in some 3rd world countries, this happens. But no one is pointing a gun to the majority of prostitutes heads telling them they have to hook.For example, in my late teens I lived in the Philippines. I've never had sex with a hooker in my life but I used to hang out in some red light districts and get drunk with friends while watching strippers dance.The funny thing is; when you go to these places, have conversations with a lot of them. Every single one of them were there by choice. They claimed that this was a way to make big money quickly instead of doing other jobs that pay them a couple of dollars a day. They seemed happy to me. You can usually tell when someone is not happy. You usually saw all of them talking to their hooker friends and their clients, laughing, giggling, being silly out of happiness.Some of my friends actually ended up dating these hookers. They were free to date these men, they were free to leave their hooker jobs and bum off these western men.And in the western world, it’s even less common… as for a western prostitute woman to be forced from the human trafficking industry. Many claim that they don’t only do it for the big bucks, it makes them feel empowered.So don’t give me this false female victim wah wah all hookers are forced BS. As you are the typical feminist, it’s no surprise that you exaggerate the problem. It’s like if 4 women get raped, feminists will say that 40 women got raped. You feminuts purposely exaggerate female problems to further demonise men due to your hatred you have towards men.Now excuse me, I need to get ready to travel 50Kms to oppress a woman. She offered me to objectify her body and give her no strings sex. She’s a victim I tell ya. Just like the women in porn sites who encourage men to objectify them, they are victims, even that they are doing it by their choice and they are objectifying themselves.
Elizabeth“It is easy to see why someone reading your comments would see that post as blaming women for something they had nothing to do with.”Please point out where this occurred?You either know my point is logical and valid but you are trying to twist things around into a stuffed balloon animal due to your feminist agenda. Or you are really as dumb as dog shit
Or you are incapable of admitting you screwed up your post.I am tempted to say "what a typical male" but I would not want to be "oppressing you."
Hey David, I don't know where to put this, and don't know if I tried a private message if you would get it, but I was checking out your boob roll, and mensactivism site caught my eye. That has limited nonsense on it, and seems to be mostly legit. I wondered what your thoughts are or if you've reviewed it lately. It seems to actually be involved in DV activism. They also have a section about companies to boycott because of their ads, I found a lot of entries there really interesting. Dunno your thoughts on this. Of course I found lots to argue with, but I was thinking that site does remind me of feminism. I don't know very much about it or the history of what's gone on there. They do focus on abuse of males a lot, though and how we need to change our minds about that. IDk.
Nicko81m: ...ridiculous because not MOST prostitutes are forced to have such a pathetic life. As I said, of course in some 3rd world countries, this happens. There are always some gangsters (and not all of them are men, but also women) who are into violence and force somebody to do something, this includes prostitution.About human trafficking, it's also about men and boys for forced labor.Regarding prostitution, the BIG majority of women are doing it out of their own choice.Germany now has legally registered about 450.000 prostitutes, paying taxes and health and retirement insurances, considered to be a job as any other job. New Zealand is also known to have good experiences with legal prostitution, same in Singapore or in Japan.The problem is starting when prostitution is illegal and is moving on into hiding like in USA. In this situation the woman is often forced to share her income with gangsters.Interesting and funny to watch is the porno-industry in Danmark, almost everything is legal there and to be a porn-model is considered to be as 'nothing special'. - Men living there have seen so many nude pictures and movies, that nobody will pay for that stuff anymore and the porno industry survives only because of export.You mentioned Philippines, nobody I know personally there is considering a life into prostitution as an option, despite being terrible poor. But of course, there are many Filipina girls who do - much easier job than working in a factory and much better paid. And if one girl does not want to continue she goes and the next one will replace her in a minute. In 3rd world countries the problem for these girls and bar-owners is often about how to find enough customers who are willing to pay. Local men are also poor in such countries and Western tourists are not everywhere.
"Regarding prostitution, the BIG majority of women are doing it out of their own choice."This is an absolute LIE. So please, there is no use even lying about this, even ask the Johns. Even prostitutes that want to do it admit this is not true, Yohan, just knock it off the issue is way too important for you to be toying with. http://www.eaves4women.co.uk/Documents/Recent_Reports/Men%20Who%20Buy%20Sex.pdfThis is a PDF of interviews with a wide sample of Johns. As you read this, there are parts where there is some feminist commentary interspersed, but it does not effect the integrity of the interview sample.You are right trafficking includes all kinds of vulnerable people, but again please do not shit on this topic for your agenda. In Germany and Holland where prostitution is legal, there are human rights messes. If a majority of women are there voluntarily they would not need to have thousands of people trafficked. My friend that lives in Holland posted a video today on this. Yohan, I currently live in the philippines, not one single fucking female in this country has a choice about what they do, and very few men do either, unless they have money. There is not a single woman here with any decent income that would do that line of work, period. There is dire, dire poverty here. People are very hardworking. They don't have factory jobs they are turning down, sorry. And better paid? Ok, Yohan, give me a break down of what they make. I'd really like to see what you know. http://endhumantrafficking.wordpress.com/2010/02/21/the-effects-of-legalization-of-prostitution-on-human-trafficking/And here is the video my friend posted today who lives in the Netherlands. It has English subtitles. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBXnZNIa-3Y
I just scrolled up and read another one of your comments.Yohan, right now I'm confused and my vision is very blurry. Are you saying you know where I am? Yes, I am in the Phils, and if you want to ship boxes fine, but one load of boxes did not show up. It has to be shipped just right. I can't read the rest, and will not be online for awhile, I actually got sick from that PDF that I posted, and I can't see well. I guess that's PTSD, I hear. Be Back later. It would not surprise me if I entirely misunderstood something.
I would love to hear how women are oppressed in Western culture for being women. It would have to be a way which a woman could not avoid, as if she has a choice it is not oppression. I seriously cannot think of a single way women are oppressed in the west.
The Biscuit Queen said... I would love to hear how women are oppressed in Western culture for being women. This is researched frequently worldwide and the results are published by the World Economic Forum in its annual Gender Gap Report.https://members.weforum.org/pdf/gendergap/report2010.pdfThe report covers 134 countries in details.USA is #19, UK is #15. No privileges for men...Switzerland is #10, both, men and women are EQUALLY rich.Interesting, Philippines is #9, which shows that Philippine men do not have privileges either, men and women are EQUALLY poor.The Gender Gap Report 2010 also shows that feminism is not helping poor people to improve their lives. Poor remains poor. Not only Philippines #9, but also SriLanka #16 (better than USA) has remarkable high scores regarding Gender Gap, but both countries remain poor and corrupt, violence everywhere, every day.Feminism is good for what?
Good for nothing.
booboonation said... This is a PDF of interviews with a wide sample of Johns.http://www.eaves4women.co.uk/http://www.eaves4women.co.uk/Documents/Recent_Reports/Men%20Who%20Buy%20Sex.pdfYes, this report is highly biased, with co-operation of Julie Bindl, a notorious man-hater in UK, and MacKinnon, USA serving a feminist charity in UK, Eaves, which is solely for females and NOT for the poor in general.The contents of this report are like that. It fails however to offer any conclusion - not even an estimate - how many women are forced into prostitution and how many are doing it out of their own decision.I found it interesting however that the report mentions that 29 percent of young men find their first sexual experiences with prostitutes as they obviously cannot find any female partner.Interesting also the one-liner in the report, that 67 percent of men believe 'most men pay for sex'. Some data used about men are very old references, back up to 1964. I wonder how relevant this report really is.
booboonation said.....Yohan, I currently live in the philippines, not one single fucking female in this country has a choice about what they do, and very few men do either...There is dire, dire poverty here. Ok, Yohan, give me a break down of what they make. I'd really like to see what you know. OK,Living in Japan and visiting Philippines and other Asian countries several times every year since about 35 years, I can say the following:Philippines is still better off than various other countries in Asia I know, for example Bangladesh, Indonesia, Vietnam.At least the Philippine government is not against foreigner, not against sending out overseas workers, and does not make problems if you help locals by sending materials of any kind as a foreigner. Also very little censorship. No gender-discrimination, so even feminists can be very happy. Not that bad compared so some other sountries nearby.Rich former Philippine female presidents and their family clans backed up by USA did not much for the Philippine ordinary people, so far 90 percent of all women, men and children living there remain EUQALLY poor. And so far, 10 percent of Philippine people are truly rich, about 8 million people or so can buy just everything they want.About my place in Cebu, the Philippine woman who is helping out for my fostergirl makes about php 15000 a month, just for selling stuff in Cebu, Mandaue, Canduman at a local market. Rather impoverished place, not so much, what she is earning, but you can survive with that, php 15000 is about USD 340,-.The almost BLIND sister of my fostergirl (22 year old) ALWAYS finds a little job, usually she is checking fruits or/and packing various items, and she is earning about php 3000 to 4000,-, about USD 70,- to 90,- a month enough for her food and anyway she is living with my fostergirl.The son of the woman taking care of my fostergirl is working as electrician and sometimes in an internet shop and the wife works for a nursery. Together about php 18000,-.The woman next door, in her 50s is working in a public school in Mandaue, her salary is about php 12000,- USD 270,-.That's about what people are earning outside of CebuCity.My fostergirl, now 14, needs for a (modest, average) private school, for food, health care, and all small items about php 15000,- per month. I also constructed the small house, and gave another very small house as a gift to the woman who takes care, frequently I am collecting materials of any kind in Tokyo and I send shipping boxes from time to time.In the place of my fostergirl, there are plenty of men and women around and all are doing some kind of job. OK, sometimes jobless, but not always without income, and nobody as far as I can see, is considering to be a prostitute or a gangster as a source of income.I wonder where you have been in Philippines, I think you stay only at one place in a slum area somewhere near Manila and have never been travelling around. For sure not all ordinary Filipinos are poor, due to many overseas workers - men and women - sending money home. Our Filipina office worker from Leyte Island has her house in Cebu, and a house in Leyte and various landplots and even a gas-station and machinery.I think your observations are very much exaggerated. Yes, there is deep poverty existing and no jobs in various regions but for sure NOT for all 90+ million people in all Philippines.
aww, cute kitty! MEOW!
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