Drama on teh Internets: Men's Rights Reddit edition

Oh, the drama!

Like many online forums, the Men's Rights subreddit on Reddit.com is a mixture of the good, the bad, and the very, very annoying. The good: A fairly large number of decent people there, ranging from moderate, non-misogynistic men's rightsers to a few brave souls willing to stand up to the fanatics. The bad: The aforementioned fanatics, posting douchey rants, and quick to dismiss all opinions coming from women ("cunts," "bitches") and/or supporters of women ("manginas"). The annoying: The moderators of the subreddit, a touchy, ban-happy fellow who calls himself Kloo2yoo, and his ineffectual sidekick, Ignatiusloyola.

It's Kloo who started up the subreddit, and Kloo who wrote the confrontational message that greets every visitor:

The men's rights movement is just a collection of people who are tired of being taken advantage of, taken for granted, and lied to. Millions of people who have independently come to the same conclusions, usually the hard way. ... This is not a feminist subreddit. It was created in opposition to feminism.

We are a million armies of 1.

In case you didn't get the message, he adds:

kloo2yoo believes that there is an international, feminist, antimale conspiracy, and encourages peaceful, but direct, action against it.

Message received: Feminists are the enemy. You are not welcome here. And indeed, visitors to the subreddit who display an excess of feminism have a tendency to get banned. (In some cases, after much protest from the decent folks in the subreddit, Kloo has relented and let them post again.) Quite a few people on Reddit now refuse to post in his subreddit because they don't feel like wasting their time in a forum from which they can be arbitrarily banned at any point. (Ignatiusloyola doesn't seem altogether happy with all of Kloo's behavior, but will not stand up to him.)

It's because of Kloo that I've put the Men's Right's subreddit in my "enemies list." Now, I have nothing against him stating his own personal opinion, however stridently he wants. What I do have a problem with is his purporting to speak for everyone in the subreddit, many of whom think his talk of an anti-male "conspiracy" is more than a little loopy. And the banning. I hate the banning.

Yes, as you may have guessed, he's banned me from the subreddit already; I had made only a handful of posts, most of which were straightforward and relatively nonconfrontational and, indeed, well-received by others in the subreddit. But Kloo saw his subreddit on my enemies list, and saw red. Never mind that he had already put feminists like myself on *his* enemies list.

Weirdly, after banning me, Kloo decided he wanted to debate some of the things I said in my Men Behaving Worse post, which had referred to his strange defense of the Women Behaving Badly posts that litter his subreddit. Only he wanted to debate me in private messages. I'm not playing that game.

So here's my message to you, Kloo-dee: If you want to debate me, debate me publicly, in a forum where I have the right to respond. Debate me here, in comments; I will not ban you no matter what you say. Or unban me from the Men's Rights subreddit, and debate me there.

Confidential message to Kloo: You just posted something in Men's Rights about your troubles tracking down a particular blog post from a particular feminist from a year ago that you had lost the link to. Heh. I know exactly what post you're talking about (and boy are you misremembering what it said). I'll happily post the link for you in the Men's Rights subreddit, but, in order for me to do that, you'll have to unban me first.

This is one of the reasons it makes sense to keep talking to your "enemies." They often know shit that you don't.

EDIT: Some tinkering, added a link.